[2008-02-01 20:10:52] <&A9> xorian: how much do you think you could upload onto what in 30 days
[2008-02-01 20:11:15] <&A9> if you were doing everything you could to get a massive e-penis on our tracker
[2008-02-01 20:11:25] <@xorian> Hm.
[2008-02-01 20:11:41] <@xorian> With my home connection - 1 GB or so :P
[2008-02-01 20:11:47] <@xorian> With a seedbox .. 700 GB or so?
[2008-02-01 20:11:50] <@LogicalUser> theres what, 10-20 scene albums released a day that could be uploaded? :P
[2008-02-01 20:11:56] <@LogicalUser> often more?
[2008-02-01 20:11:58] <&A9> with approximately what ratio?
[2008-02-01 20:12:18] <&A9> 3.0? 5.0?
[2008-02-01 20:12:25] <@xorian> Depends from the material ..
[2008-02-01 20:12:32] <&A9> guess
[2008-02-01 20:12:49] <@xorian> The ratio I would have after 30 days of uploading my stuff?
[2008-02-01 20:13:10] * @xorian ponders.
[2008-02-01 20:13:14] <@xorian> 150 ? :P
[2008-02-01 20:14:45] <@xorian> Why?
[2008-02-01 20:15:56] <&A9> i have an idea to fix the economy
[2008-02-01 20:16:04] <&A9> iv been doing it myself
[2008-02-01 20:16:22] <&A9> but if we got the whole staff on board, it could seriously do something
[2008-02-01 20:16:38] <@FZeroX> what?
[2008-02-01 20:16:39] <@xorian> Want me to supply some music? :P
[2008-02-01 20:16:42] <&A9> we essentially have the staff horde as much upload as possible
[2008-02-01 20:16:48] <&A9> on their non-staff accounts
[2008-02-01 20:16:53] <&A9> then reset it
[2008-02-01 20:16:56] <&Zero_Cool> We cannot upload on the seedbox. it is tied to the site.
[2008-02-01 20:17:21] <&Zero_Cool> Seriously puts the site in jeopardy legally.
[2008-02-01 20:17:46] <@LogicalUser> so, we need a patsy to 'upload' them? :P
[2008-02-01 20:17:47] * @xorian prepares some albums, just in case.
[2008-02-01 20:18:12] <&Zero_Cool> exactly logical.
[2008-02-01 20:18:12] <@xorian> I could ask a fellow scener to fxp uhm, say 100gb of vinyl stuff? :P
[2008-02-01 20:18:25] <&Zero_Cool> xorian WE cannot upload from the box.
[2008-02-01 20:18:30] <&A9> what i mean is
[2008-02-01 20:18:30] <@xorian> Zero_Cool, I know :)
[2008-02-01 20:18:38] <@xorian> What I ment was, you'd have some stuff to upload!
[2008-02-01 20:18:39] <@xorian> ;)
[2008-02-01 20:18:42] <&A9> we need to get as much ratio as possible into accounts we can reset
[2008-02-01 20:18:45] <@FZeroX> I love how we're talking about fixing the economy while there's a non-time-limited freeleech announced on the front page
[2008-02-01 20:18:59] <@xorian> FZeroX, good point.
[2008-02-01 20:19:01] <&A9> which will essentailly remove x00 gigs from the economy
[2008-02-01 20:19:13] <@xorian> A9, freeleech should be= free upload and free download :p
[2008-02-01 20:19:22] * @LogicalUser throws the seedbox on the new freeleech
[2008-02-01 20:19:29] <&A9> if we could remove something like 1 TB, then we can undo all our current damage
[2008-02-01 20:19:33] <&Zero_Cool> That album will be forever freeleech. IT is a partnership with the artist.
[2008-02-01 20:19:34] <@FZeroX> [20:02] <@FZeroX> I'm working on it
[2008-02-01 20:19:50] <&A9> xorian: kills incentive
[2008-02-01 20:20:00] <@FZeroX> no it doesn't
[2008-02-01 20:20:01] <@xorian> incentive?
[2008-02-01 20:20:06] <&A9> makes users treat those like public trackers
[2008-02-01 20:20:10] <@FZeroX> so many users said they downloaded the staff picks just cos they're awesome and it's new users
[2008-02-01 20:20:19] <@xorian> something that incites or tends to incite to action or greater effort, as a reward offered for increased productivity.
[2008-02-01 20:20:19] <@FZeroX> and enough will seed out of heart goodness to keep them going
[2008-02-01 20:20:20] <@xorian> Hm.
[2008-02-01 20:20:24] <&A9> most people dont seed more then they need to cause they're lazy asses
[2008-02-01 20:20:37] <@FZeroX> well then abolish freeleech
[2008-02-01 20:21:01] <@FZeroX> you're trying to fix something which is breaking at a rate far faster than we can ever meet
[2008-02-01 20:21:05] <&A9> we cant abolish it
[2008-02-01 20:21:07] <&A9> to many complaints
[2008-02-01 20:21:11] <@xorian> Either remove the freeleech, or make uploading not count for freeleech as well. Too many people get their ratio from freeleech things.
[2008-02-01 20:21:14] <&A9> we need to find a balance
[2008-02-01 20:21:15] <&Zero_Cool> Try having that discussion with Whatman.. You have no idea how happy he is about this recent event.
[2008-02-01 20:21:16] <@LogicalUser> the incentive is.... free albums?
[2008-02-01 20:21:19] <@FZeroX> we CAN abolish it
[2008-02-01 20:21:19] <@MattieTK> screw complaints, this is a dictatorship -_-
[2008-02-01 20:21:22] <@FZeroX> just explain WHY
[2008-02-01 20:21:26] <@LogicalUser> it doesnt have to be good for ratio
[2008-02-01 20:21:36] <@dblaze|gone> I thought we decided that in gazelle, upload and download will be free?
[2008-02-01 20:21:38] *** dblaze|gone changed nick to dblaze
[2008-02-01 20:21:40] <&A9> the requests system can counterbalance small scale freeleech
[2008-02-01 20:21:42] <@xorian> We run the site, screw the people who complain because they could no longer download stuff for free
[2008-02-01 20:21:42] <@dblaze> 'mornin guys
[2008-02-01 20:21:51] <@FZeroX> there is no such thing as small scale freeleech
[2008-02-01 20:21:57] <&A9> but we need to undo the damage which has all ready been done
[2008-02-01 20:22:03] <@dblaze> seriously, why are we still talking about this?
[2008-02-01 20:22:05] <&A9> yes there is
[2008-02-01 20:22:17] <@xorian> A9, simply keep a staff vote? :p
[2008-02-01 20:22:17] <&A9> dblaze: it got brought up and i have an idea to fix it
[2008-02-01 20:22:25] <@dblaze> ok
[2008-02-01 20:22:35] <@MattieTK> there isn't, once someone sees something on freeleech, everyone is going to hop on to gain ratio, even if they don't want the album
[2008-02-01 20:22:36] <@dblaze> but isn't it going to be fixed in gazelle? free up and down?
[2008-02-01 20:22:37] <@FZeroX> there is no way we can undo the damage
[2008-02-01 20:22:45] <@FZeroX> just me on the last freeleech on just one album did 35 gigs upload
[2008-02-01 20:23:01] <@dblaze> how the fuck did you do that? on your seedbox?
[2008-02-01 20:23:11] <@LogicalUser> FZeroX, good, ratio in the hands of someone whos not gonna abuse/ride that 35gb for the next few months
[2008-02-01 20:23:15] <&A9> everyone STFU
[2008-02-01 20:23:32] <@dblaze> hehe
[2008-02-01 20:23:55] <&A9> at the moment, everything is fine
[2008-02-01 20:24:02] <@FZeroX> yeah I was uploading at almost 50% capacity at one point :P
[2008-02-01 20:24:07] <@FZeroX> (6 megabytes per second)
[2008-02-01 20:24:07] <&A9> im talking about undoing damage which was done in the PAST
[2008-02-01 20:24:10] <@FZeroX> ok
[2008-02-01 20:24:16] <@dblaze> okay A9
[2008-02-01 20:24:20] <&A9> ie the 10 gigs free for 2,000 users
[2008-02-01 20:24:21] <@dblaze> but I missed the start of this
[2008-02-01 20:24:25] <&A9> and all that crap
[2008-02-01 20:24:28] <@FZeroX> Rob Dougan - Furious Angels, together the FLAC and V0 add up to 1.6 TERABYTES of free credit
[2008-02-01 20:24:28] <@dblaze> right
[2008-02-01 20:24:34] <@FZeroX> that's ONE choice on ONE freeleech
[2008-02-01 20:24:43] <&A9> we need to somehow extract upload from the economy
[2008-02-01 20:24:50] <@dblaze> agreed
[2008-02-01 20:24:52] <@LogicalUser> how many users got the 12gb bonus at start?
[2008-02-01 20:25:00] <@FZeroX> if all of us hoard upload and blank accounts.. we'll barely scratch that
[2008-02-01 20:25:01] <&A9> which is why i suggested hoarding ratio on non-staff accounts
[2008-02-01 20:25:08] <&A9> and just removing it on those accounts
[2008-02-01 20:25:16] <@dblaze> interesting
[2008-02-01 20:25:20] <@dblaze> how do we do that?
[2008-02-01 20:25:23] <@LogicalUser> its a good idea for small-scale upload recovery
[2008-02-01 20:25:24] <@xorian> A9, we're talking about massive amounts that have to be uploaded ..
[2008-02-01 20:25:24] <&A9> if one staffer downloads 50 gigs and uploads 100 gigs
[2008-02-01 20:25:26] <@FZeroX> about 50GB of my 108GB uploaded isn't accounted for by freeleech :P
[2008-02-01 20:25:32] <@FZeroX> and I upload quite a few torrents
[2008-02-01 20:25:35] <@FZeroX> this problem is *huge*
[2008-02-01 20:25:40] <&A9> we can just scratch that, and 50 gigs out the economy
[2008-02-01 20:26:05] <&A9> its not much
[2008-02-01 20:26:07] <@FZeroX> 20 staffers
[2008-02-01 20:26:09] <&A9> but its a start
[2008-02-01 20:26:11] <@FZeroX> 50 gigs each a month?
[2008-02-01 20:26:21] <@MattieTK> we need more than that, it's a start, but we don't all own seedboxes, and even if we did, we couldn't remove 20,000GB for about a year
[2008-02-01 20:26:37] <@FZeroX> in one month we could remove the impact of.. not even one album from one freeleech
[2008-02-01 20:26:41] <@dblaze> I can't afford that much bandwidth to my home isp
[2008-02-01 20:26:43] <@FZeroX> how many freeleeches do we do a month?
[2008-02-01 20:26:48] <@xorian> Me neither.
[2008-02-01 20:26:50] <&Zero_Cool> whats the current download vs upload totals?
[2008-02-01 20:26:53] <@xorian> My limit is way too small.
[2008-02-01 20:26:59] <@dblaze> Zero_Cool are you sylar?
[2008-02-01 20:27:03] <&A9> Zero_Cool: approx 3.0
[2008-02-01 20:27:12] <&A9> Zero_Cool: /nick qMark
[2008-02-01 20:27:17] <@FZeroX> with seven picks in a freeleech, using A9's system, we could do one freeleech every 7 months and we'd break even
[2008-02-01 20:27:17] <@dblaze> ah
[2008-02-01 20:27:19] <&Zero_Cool> haha nah :P
[2008-02-01 20:27:20] <@dblaze> hehe
[2008-02-01 20:27:40] <@FZeroX> maybe.
[2008-02-01 20:27:51] <@dblaze> what about amnesty?
[2008-02-01 20:27:52] <&A9> well we need other ideas then
[2008-02-01 20:27:55] <&Zero_Cool> the freeleech system is changing when we have the ability. Its just not stopping suddenly.
[2008-02-01 20:28:00] <@dblaze> like they do for guns?
[2008-02-01 20:28:02] <@LogicalUser> does the 'bounty' system for requests remove ratio on the whole? or just redistribute?
[2008-02-01 20:28:10] <&Zero_Cool> removes
[2008-02-01 20:28:13] <@FZeroX> Zero_Cool, it's like I'm saying one thing and you're hearing another
[2008-02-01 20:28:13] <@LogicalUser> k
[2008-02-01 20:28:15] <@MattieTK> imo it needs to stop until we have the ability
[2008-02-01 20:28:24] <@dblaze> surrender ratio in exchange for something else. like a couple invites, or a special user class?
[2008-02-01 20:28:24] <@LogicalUser> mattieTK the plan is 1 more freeleech
[2008-02-01 20:28:30] <@FZeroX> this problem has already reached the point where we can't fix it and every freeleech makes it worse
[2008-02-01 20:28:34] <@MattieTK> i'm not involved in that then
[2008-02-01 20:28:37] <@dblaze> huh? tell me if anyone likes that idea
[2008-02-01 20:28:45] <@xorian> Pff, freeleech should just stop. There's no easy way to fix the ratio economy on the site, to undo the damage freeleech torrents do.
[2008-02-01 20:28:46] <@LogicalUser> or last i heard?
[2008-02-01 20:28:58] <&A9> LogicalUser: removes a %
[2008-02-01 20:28:59] <@MattieTK> i'm boycotting staff picks until someone codes it to be a zerosum system
[2008-02-01 20:29:10] <&Zero_Cool> have funb
[2008-02-01 20:29:13] <&Zero_Cool> boycott away
[2008-02-01 20:29:14] <@MattieTK> hope a few others might join me
[2008-02-01 20:29:14] <@dblaze> I said this like two rounds ago, that they were bad
[2008-02-01 20:29:15] <@LogicalUser> a9 hmm?
[2008-02-01 20:29:21] <@dblaze> earlier even
[2008-02-01 20:29:22] * FZeroX is in on the boycott too
[2008-02-01 20:29:43] <@dblaze> hey guys, please respond to my idea above
[2008-02-01 20:29:44] <@FZeroX> I hoped my seedbox would "soak up" a lot in the last one but it barely scratched it.. I accounted for 5%, I think it was
[2008-02-01 20:29:45] <&A9> LogicalUser: it redistributes and garnishes 50%
[2008-02-01 20:29:53] <@LogicalUser> a9 ahh, k
[2008-02-01 20:29:58] <@FZeroX> dblaze: dunno if anyone would do it, plus invites are closed atm
[2008-02-01 20:29:59] <&A9> one could call it a tax almost
[2008-02-01 20:30:08] <@dblaze> well, give them something
[2008-02-01 20:30:20] <@FZeroX> how many users have we got on risingtide?
[2008-02-01 20:30:22] <@dblaze> eh? why don't we just ask users to surrend it
[2008-02-01 20:30:28] <@FZeroX> if we combine risingtide with seedboxes...
[2008-02-01 20:30:41] <@FZeroX> and then get them to give up their excessive upload stats
[2008-02-01 20:30:54] <@MattieTK> we cant ask that of them
[2008-02-01 20:31:18] <@MattieTK> that would cause an outry larger than the one we'd get if we just stopped freeleech
[2008-02-01 20:31:29] <@FZeroX> not really, there's only like 5 users using it :P
[2008-02-01 20:31:38] <@LogicalUser> our VIPs would start an uprising over upload stats?
[2008-02-01 20:31:39] <@LogicalUser> doubtful
[2008-02-01 20:31:43] <@MattieTK> i mean if we asked users to surrender upload
[2008-02-01 20:31:52] <@FZeroX> they're all VIPs
[2008-02-01 20:32:01] <@MattieTK> secondly, we'd be admitting we made a huge mistake
[2008-02-01 20:32:06] <@dblaze> why not though?
[2008-02-01 20:32:10] <@dblaze> yeah, I thought of that
[2008-02-01 20:32:12] <@dblaze> bad PR
[2008-02-01 20:32:39] <@FZeroX> new thought: mathematically this is a problem, but is it a problem in reality?
[2008-02-01 20:32:49] <@MattieTK> yes
[2008-02-01 20:32:49] <@dblaze> we all need to agree on something
[2008-02-01 20:32:53] <@dblaze> I think so
[2008-02-01 20:32:54] <@FZeroX> does the numerical problem produce a real-world problem that can't be fixed through other means?
[2008-02-01 20:33:00] <@LogicalUser> keep in mind there is constant influx of new data
[2008-02-01 20:33:04] <@dblaze> I was just gonna say this threatens to dismantle the entire community
[2008-02-01 20:33:07] <@FZeroX> what is the effect then?
[2008-02-01 20:33:09] <&Zero_Cool> You are all just going to run in circles because well you need to have WhatMan in this discussion and that won't happen for 2 more weeks.. There is one more freeleech prior to gazelle in all likelihood. so really chill.
[2008-02-01 20:33:10] <&A9> FZeroX: no
[2008-02-01 20:33:19] <&A9> in math its a problem
[2008-02-01 20:33:27] <@LogicalUser> always new music, new releases being uploaded
[2008-02-01 20:33:27] <&A9> and its not something im fond of
[2008-02-01 20:33:43] <@MattieTK> Zero_Cool: i believe staff consensus should rule if we get a vast amount of agreement until whatman comes back
[2008-02-01 20:33:44] <&A9> but if we stop freeleeching new stuff from this point on, then its all good
[2008-02-01 20:33:47] <@xorian> Pff. Make freeleech torrents for PU+ only. Problem solved :P
[2008-02-01 20:33:53] <&Zero_Cool> No it doesnt MattieTK
[2008-02-01 20:33:59] <@LogicalUser> there wont be another freeleech until after whatman comes back anyways, right?
[2008-02-01 20:34:04] <@LogicalUser> by the dates anyways?
[2008-02-01 20:34:06] <&A9> im trying to come up with a counterbalance
[2008-02-01 20:34:07] <&Zero_Cool> It is a dictatorship as you even said we do not make big changes
[2008-02-01 20:34:09] <@FZeroX> whatman trusts us enough to make some decisions ''-_-
[2008-02-01 20:34:14] <@MattieTK> LogicalUser: Zero_Cool isn't listening to us so he'll do one anyway
[2008-02-01 20:34:17] <&Zero_Cool> WE do not make those changes
[2008-02-01 20:34:23] <&A9> some way which we dont need to change our current behaviour
[2008-02-01 20:34:28] <@FZeroX> if he comes back and we say "yeah we didn't do a freeleech because we were worried" he's not gonna flip
[2008-02-01 20:34:32] <&A9> but still keep everyone happy
[2008-02-01 20:34:35] <&A9> and the gr low
[2008-02-01 20:34:37] <@FZeroX> that's not making a change, that's inaction
[2008-02-01 20:34:43] <@xorian> A9, outbalancing terabytes is not gonna be easy :P
[2008-02-01 20:34:48] <@LogicalUser> MattieTK, last i heard the 'plan' was 1 more freeleech before gazzelle
[2008-02-01 20:34:53] <@dblaze> agreed, we don't make big changes like that. but, we need to have this discussion at some point to come up with solutions
[2008-02-01 20:35:01] <@MattieTK> A9: just pause it until we can rewrite the freeleech system, or work out how to do it, FZeroX is already looking into it for us
[2008-02-01 20:35:03] <&Zero_Cool> right but have it with him present.
[2008-02-01 20:35:05] <@LogicalUser> and didnt someone say 2-3weeks between freeleeches?
[2008-02-01 20:35:11] <@FZeroX> ok
[2008-02-01 20:35:15] <&A9> ok
[2008-02-01 20:35:19] <&A9> now i have stuff to do
[2008-02-01 20:35:23] <@FZeroX> what is the real world significance of this economic imbalance? what is the effect?
[2008-02-01 20:35:25] <&A9> so change the topic :P
[2008-02-01 20:35:28] <&A9> so i can get back to work
[2008-02-01 20:35:34] <@FZeroX> MattieTK: ?
[2008-02-01 20:35:40] <@dblaze> well, we can still have it, so that we have some workable ideas to then discuss when he gets back, know what I mean? there's still value in hammering something out
[2008-02-01 20:36:09] <@dblaze> FZeroX: the effect is people don't seed, our torrents aren't well seeded and fast, and people look elsewhere for their music torrents
[2008-02-01 20:36:15] <@FZeroX> ok
[2008-02-01 20:36:19] <@dblaze> then we lose
[2008-02-01 20:36:20] <@FZeroX> can we not fix that through other means
[2008-02-01 20:36:24] <@MattieTK> real wold significance FZeroX? well, upload will devalue, peeople will upload less and hit and run more becuase they dont need to keep things seeded, it will also result in a greater gap between users at the top and users at the bottom, who will find it very hard to seed
[2008-02-01 20:36:27] <@FZeroX> bitmetv have systems to track hit n runners
[2008-02-01 20:36:36] <@dblaze> I see where you're going with this, maybe there is
[2008-02-01 20:36:39] <@dblaze> but not afaik
[2008-02-01 20:36:43] <@FZeroX> blueboybob is continually whinging about hit and runners
[2008-02-01 20:36:49] <@FZeroX> is ratio more important than not hit n running? no
[2008-02-01 20:36:57] <&Zero_Cool> no its not at all
[2008-02-01 20:37:00] <@FZeroX> can we make a system to track and punish hit n runners? yes
[2008-02-01 20:37:04] <&Zero_Cool> and thats why there are hit and run rules now.
[2008-02-01 20:37:12] <@FZeroX> would banning persistent hit n runners remove 100s of gigabytes from the economy? yes
[2008-02-01 20:37:16] <&Zero_Cool> that is the big issue.
[2008-02-01 20:37:18] <@MattieTK> we wouldnt need hit and run rules if ratio wasn't so abundant
[2008-02-01 20:37:26] <@FZeroX> disagree, it's always a problem
[2008-02-01 20:37:37] <&Zero_Cool> Seeding is > than ratio always.
[2008-02-01 20:37:42] <@MattieTK> it would be much, much less of a probelm
[2008-02-01 20:37:51] <@MattieTK> people would feel the need to seed
[2008-02-01 20:37:55] <@FZeroX> well I think we can kill both birds with one stone
[2008-02-01 20:38:00] <&Zero_Cool> If there were hit and run rules there would be no ratio issues
[2008-02-01 20:38:11] <@dblaze> right
[2008-02-01 20:38:21] <@dblaze> because the end negative result of ratio glut is no seeding
[2008-02-01 20:38:30] <@LogicalUser> can we get a way to reset a user's ratio? i could see myself removing a fair bit of the 10gb upload credit from old, inactive users
[2008-02-01 20:38:34] <@dblaze> so if people had to seed, I guess it wouldn't matter so much
[2008-02-01 20:38:45] <@LogicalUser> could probably net a good 5TB of upload removed
[2008-02-01 20:38:47] <@FZeroX> so if we had: a) freeleech being 0/0 and b) anti hit and running tracking
[2008-02-01 20:38:50] <@FZeroX> this problem would end?
[2008-02-01 20:38:53] <@MattieTK> yes
[2008-02-01 20:38:58] <@LogicalUser> and inactive users cant bitch about their stats
[2008-02-01 20:39:00] <@xorian> A9
[2008-02-01 20:39:03] <@MattieTK> through slow filtration of users
[2008-02-01 20:39:04] <@xorian> I have a great idea!
[2008-02-01 20:39:10] <@xorian> Hm
[2008-02-01 20:39:13] <&A9> tell!
[2008-02-01 20:39:14] <@xorian> No, I don't. Never mind :)
[2008-02-01 20:39:18] <@FZeroX> removing upload from inactive users will NOT help
[2008-02-01 20:39:19] * @LogicalUser hates reactivating some chump who gets to keep his 10gb upload credit
[2008-02-01 20:39:20] <&A9> asdufaekj;cS
[2008-02-01 20:39:21] <@MattieTK> i knew it xorian
[2008-02-01 20:39:23] <&Zero_Cool> yes it would FZeroX and me and whatman have discussed the hit and run thing greatly. He wants it. but we need a script.
[2008-02-01 20:39:23] <&A9> BOOOO
[2008-02-01 20:39:25] <@xorian> I thought, let's remove some ratios of dsabled users.
[2008-02-01 20:39:28] <@FZeroX> that isn't in circulation, so it's already removed
[2008-02-01 20:39:34] <@LogicalUser> FZeroX i just meant, when we re-enable them
[2008-02-01 20:39:36] <@MattieTK> lol xorian
[2008-02-01 20:39:39] <@FZeroX> yes
[2008-02-01 20:39:40] <&A9> lmao
[2008-02-01 20:39:41] <@LogicalUser> not while disabled
[2008-02-01 20:39:41] <@FZeroX> oooooooh!
[2008-02-01 20:39:45] <@dblaze> hehe
[2008-02-01 20:39:52] <@FZeroX> when we reenable disabled users, take them back down to 1.0
[2008-02-01 20:39:52] <@dblaze> I like that idea LogicalUser
[2008-02-01 20:40:02] <@dblaze> yes, that would be a great start
[2008-02-01 20:40:08] <@dblaze> like in D&D
[2008-02-01 20:40:14] <@LogicalUser> all i need is a way to do that, without having to harass A9 each time? :P
[2008-02-01 20:40:20] <&Zero_Cool> yeah most of the disables that get re enabled are our mistake
[2008-02-01 20:40:23] <&Zero_Cool> we cannot do that
[2008-02-01 20:40:26] <@dblaze> if you get resurrected, you come back with only 2HP, not your macx
[2008-02-01 20:40:28] <@xorian> A9
[2008-02-01 20:40:31] <@FZeroX> Zero_Cool: no
[2008-02-01 20:40:33] <@xorian> How's the anti cheat idea going?
[2008-02-01 20:40:34] <@FZeroX> that's completely untrue
[2008-02-01 20:40:37] <@LogicalUser> zero_cool i'm jus sayin the 'barely/never' used accounts
[2008-02-01 20:40:40] <@xorian> Firon isn't very helpful I assume?
[2008-02-01 20:40:41] <&Zero_Cool> the only ones that are not our mistake are inactive which have no ratio to take.
[2008-02-01 20:40:50] <@FZeroX> that's not true either
[2008-02-01 20:40:52] <@LogicalUser> zero_cool inactive ones do have ratio, the 10gb
[2008-02-01 20:41:03] <@FZeroX> I keep reenabling users who were inactive long enough to get banned but have ratio
[2008-02-01 20:41:15] <&Zero_Cool> those were our mistakes too
[2008-02-01 20:41:19] <&Zero_Cool> the script does not work.
[2008-02-01 20:41:22] <@FZeroX> if they're inactive we give them their account back on the grounds that we take their ratio down to 1.0
[2008-02-01 20:41:27] <@FZeroX> plenty of them are legit
[2008-02-01 20:41:27] <&Zero_Cool> half of the disables were seeding well disabled.
[2008-02-01 20:41:30] <@MattieTK> guys, what's the maximum DL amount you can have before people can be disabled for their ratio?
[2008-02-01 20:41:36] <@FZeroX> 5GB
[2008-02-01 20:41:43] <@MattieTK> seriously?
[2008-02-01 20:41:49] <@MattieTK> we have a lot of work to do them
[2008-02-01 20:41:49] <@dblaze> but that's just academic at this point
[2008-02-01 20:41:55] <@LogicalUser> uhh, doesnt ratio watch kick in at 10gb?
[2008-02-01 20:41:55] <@MattieTK> i'll call it 15
[2008-02-01 20:41:56] <@dblaze> it's not scripted in afaik
[2008-02-01 20:41:56] <@FZeroX> Zero_Cool, I've only been in the disabled chan a little bit but more users are genuine inactives than not
[2008-02-01 20:42:12] <@LogicalUser> there are definetly ALOT of actual inactive users
[2008-02-01 20:42:16] <@MattieTK> guys
[2008-02-01 20:42:17] <@dblaze> no, it kicks in at 5
[2008-02-01 20:42:30] <@MattieTK> from now on can we stop enabling people who have been disabled for ratio
[2008-02-01 20:42:37] <&A9> LogicalUser: a way to do what?
[2008-02-01 20:42:44] <@FZeroX> I've never reenabled someone who has been disabled for ratio
[2008-02-01 20:42:48] <@LogicalUser> a9 reset a user's ratio when we re-enable
[2008-02-01 20:42:55] <@LogicalUser> for those who are at 10gb up, 0 down
[2008-02-01 20:43:03] <&A9> oh, ratio controls
[2008-02-01 20:43:33] <@dblaze> MattieTK: we pretty much do anyway. when I look at their stats, I only enable people who got wrongly disabled it seems
[2008-02-01 20:43:41] <@MattieTK> good
[2008-02-01 20:43:45] <@MattieTK> cause i'm killing about 15 accounts
[2008-02-01 20:43:48] <@dblaze> but if they'd get disabled if the new system was in place, then they don't get it back
[2008-02-01 20:44:02] <&Zero_Cool> MattieTK killing them for what?
[2008-02-01 20:44:10] <@MattieTK> terrible ratios
[2008-02-01 20:44:15] <@dblaze> like the guy who leeched a 35GB torrent, then couldn't figure out why his account was disabled
[2008-02-01 20:44:15] <&Zero_Cool> they have time after having 5gb down to be disabled
[2008-02-01 20:44:16] <@FZeroX> I was instructed to reenable users who were genuinely inactive if they solemnly swear to use it and upload etc
[2008-02-01 20:44:17] <@dblaze> he's gone
[2008-02-01 20:44:42] <@MattieTK> Zero_Cool: these guys are peons and have over 15gb down
[2008-02-01 20:44:45] <@dblaze> I have also been giving people a second chance for that too FZeroX, but tell them they'll not get a third
[2008-02-01 20:44:49] <@MattieTK> and ratios less than 0.1
[2008-02-01 20:44:51] <@MattieTK> 0.01*
[2008-02-01 20:44:53] <@LogicalUser> i've re-enabled maybe 10 people for ratio so far
[2008-02-01 20:44:59] <@LogicalUser> 8 of whom are above 0.5 now
[2008-02-01 20:45:06] <@FZeroX> I've enabled like 3 or something
[2008-02-01 20:45:07] <@dblaze> MattieTK: how long as memeber?
[2008-02-01 20:45:14] <@MattieTK> weeks
[2008-02-01 20:45:18] <@dblaze> disable
[2008-02-01 20:45:21] <@MattieTK> exactly
[2008-02-01 20:45:36] <&A9> ok
[2008-02-01 20:45:44] <@dblaze> I've processed probably 100-150 disabled users in that channel so far
[2008-02-01 20:45:51] <&A9> everyone slow down for a second and update me with wtf is going on?
[2008-02-01 20:45:51] <@dblaze> it seems
[2008-02-01 20:45:57] <@FZeroX> we need to make sure we catch people earlier if they dl loads and don't ul, they make the problem worse
[2008-02-01 20:45:59] <&A9> in a nice ordered list
[2008-02-01 20:46:24] <@dblaze> the way I see it now, we're just manually doing what the script should be doing for us, in that channel
[2008-02-01 20:46:27] <@FZeroX> we're thinking of ways to mitigate the problem
[2008-02-01 20:46:33] <@FZeroX> what script?
[2008-02-01 20:46:45] <&A9> firstly, its not an immediate problem
[2008-02-01 20:46:54] <&A9> hdbits has like a 10.0
[2008-02-01 20:46:57] <&A9> we have a 3.0
[2008-02-01 20:47:03] <@FZeroX> torrents are not getting seeded
[2008-02-01 20:47:07] <&A9> so we're not to far gone
[2008-02-01 20:47:07] <@FZeroX> hit and running is a problem
[2008-02-01 20:47:10] <@FZeroX> just ask blueboybob
[2008-02-01 20:47:22] <&A9> i saw
[2008-02-01 20:47:22] <@LogicalUser> and H&R rules/enforcement could help alot
[2008-02-01 20:47:28] <&A9> there will be
[2008-02-01 20:47:29] <@MattieTK> who by the way had his entire warning log deleted, please be careful in future Zero_Cool
[2008-02-01 20:47:36] <&A9> but its going to need to wait for gazelle
[2008-02-01 20:47:41] <&A9> sorry, but ya
[2008-02-01 20:47:42] <@MattieTK> can we make warning logs read only in gazelle A9? =/
[2008-02-01 20:47:51] <&skullyzero|work> who is Zero_Cool?
[2008-02-01 20:47:56] <@LogicalUser> Qmark
[2008-02-01 20:47:57] <@MattieTK> qmark
[2008-02-01 20:48:12] <@dblaze> also, we have to account for all the users disabled cause of that cookie problem
[2008-02-01 20:48:14] <&skullyzero|work> ah ok
[2008-02-01 20:48:17] <@dblaze> this will peter off over time
[2008-02-01 20:48:19] <&Zero_Cool> MattieTK do not tell me what to do. it was deleted for a reason
[2008-02-01 20:48:29] <@MattieTK> and that was?
[2008-02-01 20:48:29] <&A9> Zero_Cool: change your bloody nick :P
[2008-02-01 20:48:31] <@LogicalUser> 577 re-enabled accounts so far
[2008-02-01 20:48:42] <@FZeroX> select count(id) from torrents where times_completed > 1 and seeders < 2;
[2008-02-01 20:48:46] <@FZeroX> who wants to guess at the answer?
[2008-02-01 20:48:54] <@MattieTK> 30k?
[2008-02-01 20:48:56] <@dblaze> 10,000
[2008-02-01 20:48:58] <@FZeroX> 26k
[2008-02-01 20:49:02] *** Zero_Cool changed nick to qMark
[2008-02-01 20:49:05] <@dblaze> damn
[2008-02-01 20:49:05] <@MattieTK> man, i rock
[2008-02-01 20:49:15] <@LogicalUser> is still seeding 6 torrents from the FIRST WEEK
[2008-02-01 20:49:28] <@LogicalUser> some with 15+ snatches so far
[2008-02-01 20:49:41] <@FZeroX> I seed all torrents in my client that have 5 seeds or less
[2008-02-01 20:49:52] <@LogicalUser> FzeroX keep in mind that count includes the snatches of disabled users
[2008-02-01 20:49:56] <@LogicalUser> who... cannot seed back
[2008-02-01 20:49:57] <@dblaze> okay, that reminds me. I wanted to ask you guys to put more details in when you disable someone, put the date, and your nick and why, at the very least. if it's a thread, link the thread. everything needs to be logged please
[2008-02-01 20:50:15] <@MattieTK> already do dblaze, unless it's freakishly obvious
[2008-02-01 20:50:16] <@dblaze> I need more to work with in that channel, and it's a good practice anyway
[2008-02-01 20:50:20] <@MattieTK> or i'm doing mass disables, like now
[2008-02-01 20:50:27] <@dblaze> even still, the log helps
[2008-02-01 20:50:31] <@LogicalUser> i'm lazy on inactivity re-enable descriptions
[2008-02-01 20:50:40] <@LogicalUser> but always detail on disables
[2008-02-01 20:50:40] <@dblaze> past something in
[2008-02-01 20:50:48] <&Kludge> Lady goes to the grocers for a cucumber. "Do you want that sliced love?" said the man. "What for says the lady. "It's a fanny i've got, not a fuckin slot machine!"
[2008-02-01 20:50:53] <@dblaze> yeah, for enable I put 'asked in #disabled" or something
[2008-02-01 20:51:10] <@dblaze> and details if necessary
[2008-02-01 20:51:21] <@FZeroX> I put in "promised to" and whatever they promised me :P
[2008-02-01 20:51:24] <@dblaze> anyway, the more logs we put, the more info we have the better
[2008-02-01 20:51:34] <&A9> http://nxnod.net/utorrent/
[2008-02-01 20:51:47] <@dblaze> yeah, I put those ppl in my friends list, but I have no way of making fucking comments on the friends list, to my chagrin
[2008-02-01 20:51:55] <@dblaze> just wanted to use chagrin
[2008-02-01 20:52:10] <@LogicalUser> if i recall, thats a gazelle feature?
[2008-02-01 20:52:16] <@dblaze> yeah
[2008-02-01 20:53:04] <&skullyzero|work> who is vars
[2008-02-01 20:53:08] <@LogicalUser> sylar
[2008-02-01 20:53:24] <@LogicalUser> i totally wanna ban the guy whos got 200gb upload, and has not grabbed a non-freeleech torrent yet
[2008-02-01 20:53:33] <@FZeroX> lol
[2008-02-01 20:53:44] <&Kludge> mmm. MattieTK made a post to that effect, LogicalUser
[2008-02-01 20:53:46] <@LogicalUser> i mean, he's not violating our rules, its just irritatng
[2008-02-01 20:53:56] <@dblaze> hehe, same
[2008-02-01 20:53:56] <@MattieTK> http://what.cd/forums.php?action=viewtopic&topicid=7955
[2008-02-01 20:54:10] <@dblaze> alright guys, gotta eat, bbl
[2008-02-01 20:54:13] *** dblaze changed nick to dblaze|away
[2008-02-01 20:55:14] <@MattieTK> i'm disabling one of my friends for ratio now, dedication ^^
[2008-02-01 20:55:26] <@LogicalUser> how bad ratio? :P
[2008-02-01 20:55:35] <&A9> 0.99 :P